並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/%E5%8C%97%E6%8A%95%E4%BA%BA%EF%BD%98%E7%94%9C%E9%BB%9E%E5%B8%AB-ep-04-%E9%97%9C%E6%B8%A1%E5%B9%B3%E5%8E%9F%E7%9A%84%E7%B1%B3%E8%BE%B2-%E5%85%AB%E4%BB%99%E5%85%AD%E4%BB%A3%E5%9C%92-%E4%BA%A6%E7%9C%9F/id1615773385?i=1000565785085